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SKILL BASED MATCHMAKING PLEASE

Flashshark

Recruit
The teams are too unfair...

Please stop mixing lvl 10 and lv 155 !
make at least 5 steps (lvl 0-30, 31-60, ....)

and seperate premade taems from random teams thanks!
 


Carlos

Owner
Staff member
Private
They took it out?
What? You don't notice anything different after we had problems with matchmaking? There was a huge backlash, and we had wait times longer than a minute. They removed it after players noticed the wait times. I forget which update it was, but it's gone.
 

CMCFLYYY

Recruit
What? You don't notice anything different after we had problems with matchmaking? There was a huge backlash, and we had wait times longer than a minute. They removed it after players noticed the wait times. I forget which update it was, but it's gone.
I have never seen anything regarding SBMM one way or the other from Activision/IW. I've seen YT vids where people use test accounts to confirm that SBMM does exist to a degree. I realize there was backlash because people cry about anything, but can you find which update they supposedly removed it? After googling I find nothing.
 

Carlos

Owner
Staff member
Private
I have never seen anything regarding SBMM one way or the other from Activision/IW. I've seen YT vids where people use test accounts to confirm that SBMM does exist to a degree. I realize there was backlash because people cry about anything, but can you find which update they supposedly removed it? After googling I find nothing.
Yeah, to a degree. Meaning parts of SBMM is gone at that point. Here's Season One Refresh, if I remember correctly...

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yNfv45MWjOA

It was crazy. I sometimes leave the lobby alone to show the difference in wait times for future reference. However, Season 4 refresh was much smoother, much. much quicker. There are some lag spikes, but I noticed that we can go from match to match with no issue. Both Warzone/Multiplayer.
 

CMCFLYYY

Recruit
Yeah, to a degree. Meaning parts of SBMM is gone at that point. Here's Season One Refresh, if I remember correctly...

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yNfv45MWjOA

It was crazy. I sometimes leave the lobby alone to show the difference in wait times for future reference. However, Season 4 refresh was much smoother, much. much quicker. There are some lag spikes, but I noticed that we can go from match to match with no issue. Both Warzone/Multiplayer.
See I've seen YT vids from the last couple months from a couple guys I follow that suggest there is still SBMM. I've never seen anything from Activision/IW either way though - do you have a link?
 

Carlos

Owner
Staff member
Private
See I've seen YT vids from the last couple months from a couple guys I follow that suggest there is still SBMM. I've never seen anything from Activision/IW either way though - do you have a link?
Doing a search isn't getting me results, but I remember tweets saying portions of SBMM being removed, but at the same time.... There was a change in the way lobby search was done mid-March, where everyone was complaining about the wait times. People noticed that SBMM has changed somewhat, and you noticed it yourself. It's not entirely gone, but you need to realize that the game is basically playing like regular Call of Duty. You can even notice it in your gameplay. It's classic Call of Duty. That's why I say SBMM the way we know it... is gone.

However, don't get all excited, because it's still there somewhat.

EDIT: Typed in "Call of Duty Wait times" and found the CharlieIntel article, and volia...

View: https://twitter.com/ATVIAssist/status/1256406582931251201

Keep in mind, this is just official announcement, but around mid-March, we has a few hotfixes that was silent.
 

Flashshark

Recruit
Back to Apex Legand! They have a good SBMM and a ranked mode!

So much better to play for me!

Really liked the military style and the weapons of WZ but it's unplayable for me...
 

Flashshark

Recruit
I've tried Ring of Elysium now, and wow! thats I true realistic military br shooter.
You have to organize your backback, look which ammunition you grab (9mm, 7,62, .50 ...).
There are upgrades for yor weapons to equip during the session...
Nice!
 
Sounds decent.
Coming from pubg I like the more in depth battle royale games.
With the lack of emphasis on looting beyond the first few minutes and how easy it is to respawn multiple times in a match, it's kind of debatable if warzone is even a battle royale game at all.
 

CMCFLYYY

Recruit
Sounds decent.
Coming from pubg I like the more in depth battle royale games.
With the lack of emphasis on looting beyond the first few minutes and how easy it is to respawn multiple times in a match, it's kind of debatable if warzone is even a battle royale game at all.
It's almost not at this point. They should get rid of Loadouts all together or make them prohibitively expensive. Something like $30k. Right now it's just 5 minutes of looting to get $10k cash to get a Loadout and then it's just a glorified game of deathmatch on a huge map.

I would rather they just get rid of Loadouts and force players to use the Blueprints you find. It would also give them an excuse to pump out more Blueprints, because if players aren't able to build Loadouts their would need to be a lot more customized floor loot available. Plus they can change them out for new skins every season = money maker for them.
 
Right now it's just 5 minutes of looting to get $10k cash to get a Loadout and then it's just a glorified game of deathmatch on a huge map.
Yep pretty much. I think it's why (for me) warzone has become really boring recently.
Since the weapon balance is so poor there are only a select few guns that are even worth making a loadout with, and since every team and their nan have their loadout within 10 mins anyway, you're sort of forced to run with the best there is.
I like your idea but I prefer the pubg/apex etc design where you find a basic weapon and loot for attachments as the game progresses. Those games stay fresh for me, because you are having to work with the best setup you can get your hands on in that specific game, and right up until the last circle your looting death boxes hoping to find that barrel/ext.mag that your guns missing.

Bit of a downer post (sorry) but right now I'm really not playing/wanting to play warzone that much. Not liking it.
 

CMCFLYYY

Recruit
Yep pretty much. I think it's why (for me) warzone has become really boring recently.
Since the weapon balance is so poor there are only a select few guns that are even worth making a loadout with, and since every team and their nan have their loadout within 10 mins anyway, you're sort of forced to run with the best there is.
"Weapon balance" is an oxymoron in this game. In most competitive shooters, there are other ways to balance weapons beyond the physical stats of the guns. I'll use CS Go and Pubg as examples since I've played a lot of both. Both games realize that not every weapon is created equal, and they don't try to force the issue and tweak weapon stats to make all the guns "balanced" with each other. Instead both games make the better weapons "rarer", with the idea being they realize certain guns are better so we'll make them harder to get to balance it out.

CS Go does this by making the better weapons cost more money. You can't buy the better weapons every round if you keep dying, or you'll run out of money quick. Sometimes you have to save or settle for less competitive weapons in a pinch. Pubg does this by reducing the loot rate for the better rifles, snipers, and attachments. You quite simply won't find the better weapons and attachments as often. That way if certain guns do happen to be better than others, like they are in real life, less players will have them because they are just harder to find. So this forces players to use "less than the best" in nearly every game, because either you don't find the best guns or you don't find the optimal attachments. This is how a BR game should work.

But Warzone CAN'T do this, because weapon rarity has been rendered obsolete by design. You loot for 5 minutes to get $10k, and then literally ANY WEAPON with ANY ATTACHMENTS you want all cost the exact same $10k. There is no physical way to make better weapons/attachments cost more than crappy weapons with no attachments. Why should an Overkill Loadout with a fully kitted HDR/FAL cost the same as a Loadout with a stock Bizon/pistol with Ghost? Not only does that not make sense, but it completely removes any kind of balancing from that perspective.

So they can't go the CS Go route and adjust the costs of different weapons, maybe Warzone could do like Pubg and make certain weapons rarer as floor loot? They actually do this, as red chests and the legendary weapons are a lot tougher to find than the crappy stock/green blueprints you find everywhere. So yes, they did try to enforce some balance here by introducing rarity among the better weapons, however this is completely undone by Loadouts. Who cares if floor loot is "balanced" when you can just loot for 5 minutes and buy a Loadout with whatever guns and attachments you want? The balanced floor loot is only used for 5 mintues and then rendered obsolete.

So what are you left with then as far as balancing weapons - just the stats. So you wind up with the devs having to tweak weapon stats so that literally just about every weapon in each class is balanced with all the others in terms of DPS/TTK. So at that point, all guns are essentially the same and it doesn't matter what you use because they're all balanced to be identical. And MW even fails at this, whether accidental or purposefully, because there are certain weapons every season that are just stupid broken. Until they "fix" them and then something else becomes stupid broken.

My 2 suggestions. First off stop trying to "balance" all the weapons with each other. I can list 4 examples off the top of my head where this game just makes no sense with how they try to balance different guns:

- The SKS is a crappier rifle that was only really in service until the AK47 came out, and the AK is literally better in every way. So there is zero excuse for the SKS to be competitive in any way.

- The FAL is a battle rifle (precursor to the modern, smaller assault rifle) that fires full-power 7.62mm NATO rounds (like older snipers and modern DMRs) designed in the 1950s, yet somehow the devs (temporarily) made it the best close-quarters "SMG" in the game? Literally hysterical.

- The Galil was designed by Isreal to improve the design of the AK and use the more modern/better 5.56mm NATO round. They did also design a variant to use the 7.62mm NATO round, but the main purpose was to modernize the AK and use the 5.56mm round. So what does MW do - they don't use either the 5.56 or 7.62mm NATO rounds, instead they make the "CR-56" use the basic 7.62x39mm AK-47 ammo. No clue what they're doing here - a Galil chambered for 7.62x39mm is basically an AK clone and should have identical stats, but somehow it has more damage range dropoffs and lower bullet velocity? LULZ.

- The new AN-94 is a real weapon - it was designed by Russia to (like the Galil) improve upon the old AK-47 design and use a modern 5.45x39mm cartridge. It hasn't seen mainstream adoption across their armed forces because the rifle is "complex and expensive" to produce, specifically because of the goofy mechanism that allows the 2-round hyperburst. So what we have here is a weapon that is literally more expensive, complex, modern, and better than the AK in all facets. Yet what does MW do with it? Somehow despite using ammo similar to the standard 5.56mm NATO round, they coded it so it does more damage than all the other 5.56 rifles mainly because they had to balance the lower sub-600rpm ROF. If the other 5.56 rifles have like 750-900rpm ROF and all deal similar damage, how would they ever possibly balance a sub-600rpm AN-94 without artificially inflating the damage???

So stop trying to force "performance balance" among all the weapon classes. Some weapons are just better than others, so rarity needs to be introduced to this game somehow. Either get rid of Loadouts entirely and just rely on the rarity of floor loot Blueprints, or.....scale the cost of a Loadout with what you purchase. If you want that stock Bizon/pistol/Ghost loadout it should be miles cheaper than an Overkill HDR/FAL loadout. If they want to keep the Loadout system in the game, scale the cost of Loadouts based on every single weapon, attachment, tactical, lethal, and perk you choose. This would introduce balance to the game, because in order to afford the better Loadouts you would have to loot longer to get the required cash. Sometimes you'll have to settle for a medicore Loadout if you have an unlucky game loot-wise. Also get rid of the free Loadouts altogether - the process of having to spend your time looting for cash to purchase a Loadout is what balances them. Giving them away for free to everyone on the map is just dumb.
 

CMCFLYYY

Recruit
I like your idea but I prefer the pubg/apex etc design where you find a basic weapon and loot for attachments as the game progresses. Those games stay fresh for me, because you are having to work with the best setup you can get your hands on in that specific game, and right up until the last circle your looting death boxes hoping to find that barrel/ext.mag that your guns missing.
As a former Pubg player, I do prefer a system where you loot for attachments and have to build weapons mid-game. This makes every game different because you aren't just saving cash for a certain Loadout, but instead having to rely on whatever you find mid-game, so like you said it increases replayability.
 
@CMCFLYYY Yep all good points man. I do think the balancing could be improved upon in it's current state though.

But you know what would help things...

Only being able to choose one custom weapon, from one loadout drop per game. At least then you could only choose a weapon to dominate close, mid or long range and your secondary would have to he something you found in-game
 

CMCFLYYY

Recruit
Yep all good points man. I do think the balancing could be improved upon in it's current state though.
Well my point was, yes they could do a better job of balancing because obviously there have been (and are currently) broken weapons in this game. But if they do "balance" them correctly, then basically every gun is identical and the only reason to use one over the other is for visual preference. What fun is that? I would prefer a game where guns are modeled after their realistic namesakes and if some guns are better than others, then they adjust the rarity or cost of those items to balance it.

Only being able to choose one custom weapon, from one loadout drop per game. At least then you could only choose a weapon to dominate close, mid or long range and your secondary would have to he something you found in-game

To me the Overkill perk makes zero sense. Why are players allowed to swap their pistol for a 2nd primary weapon at all? Don't you need Overkill to have this ability? If they made it so you could only carry ONE primary and a pistol/RPG as your secondary, then you would have to buy an Overkill class just to equip a 2nd primary. That would also eliminate the current meta of buying an Overkill Loadout first, then going to a Ghost Loadout 2nd and picking up your weapons from the previous class. Only one primary allowed at all times unless you have purchased an Overkill class, which to piggy-back off what I discussed above, should be a more expensive Loadout because you are buying 2 primaries instead of only 1. So you'd have to loot longer to afford this Overkill class, but if you successfully do so you are rewarded.

Risk vs Reward is the name of the game in a BR. Do you risk crossing that field to go loot those buildings? Do you push this squad now or wait for a better advantage - what if they have better weapons than your current outfit? Do you hotdrop one of the high loot areas and risk losing a squadmate early, or do you chute way out from the plane so you can loot in peace in a lower loot area? Balancing risk and reward.

There is none of that in Warzone. You drop ANYWHERE on the map from the plane, doesn't matter where. Yes there are more legendary crates in certain areas, but nobody uses floor loot for longer than 5 minutes anyway so who cares. Drop whereever you want, loot cash for 5 minutes, and buy your perfect Loadout. Then wait another 1-2 minutes and get your free Loadout and you're set for the remainder of the game. Glorified deathmatch. Might as well let you parachute from the plane with your Loadouts and just play a 150-man deathmatch.
 
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